Pulling the engine from an L400

northriver · Post by **northriver** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 12:28 pm

I think the engine in my L400 is seized.

Long story short did an oil change on the Delica a few days ago before we were to leave on our next planned road trip. Obviously was not paying attention ... the gasket from the old filter did not come off with the filter ... it stayed on the filter housing attached to the van. I did not realize this at the time ... nor did the new filter feel any different when it was screwed on. I did not check the old filter for the gasket ... I do not think I will be forgetting that check again.

As usual I idled the van in the shop prior to replacing the skid plates and nothing leaked. At highway speeds the doubled gasket blew and the engine lost all of its oil within 5 kilometres of the house. I am guessing if I had reacted faster to the engine warning light (I had under a minute of warning) I would be better off right now.

Once I figured out what had happened I re-sealed the oil filter, replaced the oil and tried to crank the engine. It cranked briefly and then it seized. I tried the starter again and it just clicked. I still have not confirmed how badly damaged the engine is, but I am guessing minimally the engine needs to be pulled and worked on ... if not replaced.

Does anybody have any experience with pulling the engine out of an L400? I have seen some discussion of the L300 and how it is dropped out the bottom, but have not seen anything about the L400. Does anybody know how the L400 is pulled?. In this case the engine will come out the top of the engine compartment. I am guessing the grill gets disassembled to make room?

I have looked at the shop manual here on this site and it has excellent detail, but does not seem to discuss the steps involved; what needs to be pulled prior to the engine and what can stay on the engine. I am wondering if anybody has done this before?

Still trying to deny that I just did this,

Chris

CREGAN · Post by **CREGAN** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 12:44 pm

Sorry to hear that. Scary to think it took such little time to mess it all up. The engine comes out of the front. Looks to be way easier than pulling it from underneath like l300's and pulling it out the top like most other vehicles. Here are some threads from the british forum (I know it is a V6 gasser but same procedure applies):

http://www.mdocuk.co.uk/forums/viewtopi ... 4ecc6e35b1
http://www.mdocuk.co.uk/forums/viewtopi ... 21e57ba5c8

Here is another one from the Aus site:
http://delicaclub.com/viewtopic.php?t=1 ... highlight=
Maybe a little more suited.

Hopefully this helps to ease the pain a little.

Craig

jessef · Post by **jessef** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 12:48 pm

A hoist will help like you wouldn't imagine. Engine-mounts-subframe so it can come out two ways.

Like Craig linked from below still attached to the subframe, or remove the front clip and pull the engine out forward with an engine hoist (more common).

Sorry to hear bro.

RichD · Post by **RichD** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 1:23 pm

In fact I am told by Coombs mechanics that L300 comes out from above and easily enough. L400 is harder to do and requires more disassembly. Of course you need hoist.

I haven't done it but you will want to carefully remove all the loom and lines so as to make replacement easier. Consider seriously a vehicle swap or pay for a rebuild as this is a lot of work for a hobbyist. Sometimes overtime pays better than DIY.

MardyDelica · Post by **MardyDelica** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 4:53 pm

Hi, sad to hear that,
not easy to do it, but if need help i have a used pull out 4m40 engine came from japan for you.
we can also install this for you if you wish,
just pm me and will glad to help you
Cheers;
Mardy

rezdiver · Post by **rezdiver** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 9:14 pm

how much time had passed before you lost your oil and you when you tried to crank the engine?
now that it has cooled down can you turn the motor at all using the crank pulley?

northriver · Post by **northriver** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 10:01 pm

rezdiver wrote:how much time had passed before you lost your oil and you when you tried to crank the engine?
now that it has cooled down can you turn the motor at all using the crank pulley?

That is the first thing I hope to try tomorrow morning ... spent today thinking about the problem.

I will try to crank the engine by hand ... I did try to turn it over with the starter when the engine was stone cold but it was definitely still seized. I will try to rotate it backwards. If I can get it to move a little backwards I will put oil in the injector openings and see if re-lubricating the pistons helps.

I am still not sure what I can get ahold of to hand crank with ... I am assuming there is a nut on the crank pulley shaft that I can put a breaker bar on.

I will see tomorrow.

northriver · Post by **northriver** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 10:34 pm

Put some thought and reading into pulling the engine today.

Here is what I've come up with for steps ... most of this is a combination of posts on other forums (the pictures and images come from the posts referenced at the bottom):

1. As components are being removed disconnect associated wiring.

tag wires with masking tape for re-attachment
make sure wiring is tucked well back before moving engine

2. Remove items in engine compartment, including:

intercooler,
battery,
air filter,
wiper motor assembly (5 bolts) (remove windscreen mechanism from above engine ... levers will unclip and leave a few bars ???)

3. Disassemble front of engine bay compartment. This includes removing:

bullbar
bumper (mounting bolts behind park lights, remove lights to get at bolts?) (51-3)
AC fans and condenser (re-charge when re-assembled)
grill (51-5)
radiator + support panel (disconnect auto transmission pipes in front of radiator) (14-16)
Panels
???
- 4. Strip accessories off of engine (can leave some in bay?)
  - starter
  - alternator
  - AC compressor (bleed air conditioning first)
  - turbo
  - inlet manifold
  - steering pump
  - Note: ok to leave turbo and injector pump on engine
  5. unbolt/disconnect gearbox in place.
  - support gearbox as close as possible to existing position (easier to line up when refitting engine).
  - There is an access panel that allows you to undo the bolts that connect the drive plate to the torque converter
  - remove inspection cover on bell housing (engine side)
  - remove bolts holding flex plate to converter (crank engine over by hand to get at all of them)
  - Note: you do not have to drop the gearbox to reach the two top bell housing bolts, you will however need 2 x 500 extension bars or a combination of sizes to make up an extension bar of approx 800mm OR easiest removal is from rear by leaving drive shafts etc set up and dropping rear auto mounts, that drops engine down so they are accessible, once un-done remount rear gearbox up
  5a. Or instead of 5. remove engine, gearbox and front transfer box (one long 7' section - no gearbox bolts to undo or drive shaft re-alignment)
  
  6. Pull engine out with a hoist
  - ??? pull engine straight out without lifting until it is free of the gearbox, makes it easier to put engine back in as all you have to do is align the engine onto the engine mounts (gives the correct angle).
  - definitely unbolt the torque converter first, makes life a whole lot simpler, + no need for a new seal + no loss of TXM fluid</li>
  - When removing engine, be careful of a front diff sensor that the bell housing will fall/lower and rest on, put something in to protect the sensor
  7. Possible problems to look for after engine is pulled.
  - seized pistons,
  - broken turbo shaft,
  - broken timing chain
  7. On re-assembly
  - Install an EGR Blanking plate between the EGR And the manifold in place of the gasket.

References

jessef · Post by **jessef** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 11:25 pm

It's easier to pull the engine without the transmission bolted on.

You 'need' an engine hoist/crane to remove it and the front frame clip will not allow the engine to be pulled 'straight' out.

Before you make plans to remove the engine, pull the head, pan and rotate the crank over by hand.

RichD · Post by **RichD** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 11:59 pm

Epic research. +500 internets to you!

northriver · Post by **northriver** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 11:22 am

Put a breaker bar and socket on the nut holding the crank pulley onto the crank shaft. I was able to crank the engine backwards easily. I did not crank it very far as I do not want to do anything (more?) to the timing belt. The engine will crank forward but sticks at the place it was seized before. Not sure what this means as far as extent of damage but at least it is not completely seized.

jfarsang wrote:It's easier to pull the engine without the transmission bolted on.

You 'need' an engine hoist/crane to remove it and the front frame clip will not allow the engine to be pulled 'straight' out.

Before you make plans to remove the engine, pull the head, pan and rotate the crank over by hand.

I think the reference to 'pulled straight out' was that he pulled the engine straight off of the transmission so that alignment would be easy for re-installation? I think he did lift the engine up after getting it clear of the transmission.

If I pull the pan and head off the engine while it is still in the van are you thinking if the damage is minimal I could repair it in place? My thinking at this point is it will either be a repair or replacement so get it out and evaluate the damage. (I did not think it would be practical to work on the engine while it was in the van).

Thanks for the feedback, any advice is welcome at this point!

jessef · Post by **jessef** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 11:41 am

4M40 has a timing chain, not a belt.

It's easier to work on an engine stand than inside the engine bay. Time is the biggest factor. If you have lots of it and can pull the engine yourself, then go for it.

Remove the tensioner before rotating the crank backwards. From the 4M40/T manual:

When assembling a 4M40, never rotate the engine backwards once the timing chain has been
fitted. This can lead to over adjusting the tensioner and causing significant damage

Your BEB's maybe toast. If doing a rebuild, do them if you pulled the engine.

The list can grow.. busted connecting rod or spun a main or rod bearing..

Have a handful of 10/12mm 1 to 3 inch bolts/nuts on hand to replace the one's that bust/snap off when removing the bumper and front clip. There are 4 long 6" one's that I had to replace when doing this :

http://www.delica.ca/forum/l400-rust-co ... 10125.html

I took pictures along the way. It gives you an idea of how things look after the engine and subframe are removed.

northriver · Post by **northriver** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 10:17 pm

Actually started to dismantle the engine today.

I recorded all of these steps as I was doing the work ... I want something that tells me where everything goes back.

Started by pulling following items out of the engine bay:

Battery,
intercooler with hoses and clamps,
air filter with hose and clamp,

Took following off of front of van:

bull board (3 17 mm bolts underneath, 4 12 mm bolts on front covered by plastic boots)
front turn signal light units (one screw at top),
front trim (radiator grill) with mitsubishi symbol in centre (uses plastic fasteners, 5 broken fasteners ... most already broken)
Wheel well splash shields ... did not completely remove ... just enough to drop it out of way of work area (2 screws and lots of two piece plastic fasteners ... some broken)
under cover panels (only one plastic connecter to frame of van ... lots of plastic connecters that also fasten bumper and splash shield)
front bumper (all bolts ... the bolts at both ends (x4) were totally rusted ... all 4 broken coming off) (left all fasteners for splash shields, panels and bumper in one of panels)

Drained the radiator.

northriver · Post by **northriver** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 10:23 am

I am maintaining a copy of the steps I am taking to dismantle the engine with pictures athttp://www.darfieldearthship.com/2012/0 ... arted.html ... I want something I can refer back to when re-assembling.

Carried on with pulling items off the front of the engine compartment this morning. Pulled the following:

radiator - remember to re-attach transmission fluid lines and check level,
air conditioning fan unit (five bolts, two electrical connections) (need glue to re-attach some of the foam that has come loose),
front support T (frame) ... took it off in two pieces so could work upper part around fasteners for headlights ... tight fit.
checked air conditioning system for pressure ... no pressure ... no surprise ... we have not had air conditioning since purchasing van this fall ... was going to look at it before summer ... imagine I will be looking at it fairly soon ...
air conditioning condensor ... wrapped lines to prevent moisture

I think the front of the engine compartment is opened up enough ... starting to puzzle out what to take off of the engine before I try to pull it ...

northriver · Post by **northriver** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 6:10 pm

Got the engine out of the van this afternoon and into the shop.

Was able to crank the engine by hand but very stiff ... not promising.

Have to make some decisions:

Replace engine - $2300.00 from Vancouver w/ return of core
Rebuild engine at a shop - anybody have a rough idea what that might cost?
Rebuild it myself - Not sure what I think about that one

Will take a closer look at it tomorrow ...

Delica Canada | Mitsubishi Van Club

Pulling the engine from an L400

Pulling the engine from an L400

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