94 l400 bucking when cold

tonydca · Post by **tonydca** » Thu Feb 28, 2013 8:30 pm

davidwwc wrote:Will it be better to put in the stop leak before filling up ? This way it will be well mixed, right? How do you usually do it, Tony?

D.C.

The stuff is thick like honey (literally) so I pour in a glob before filling up, assuming that it will coat the inlet pipe on the way down (rather than pooling in the bottom of the tank) and trusting that the diesel washing down over it will mix it sufficiently.

So far so good.

ruggles · Post by **ruggles** » Sat Mar 02, 2013 7:04 pm

So my cold start was almost perfect today... I fixed my drl issue today and when i had first disconnected my batteries I noticed that the grounds were pretty loose. Im thinking maybe ot had something to do with it. It stumbled once or twice and then it was all good. I also cycled the glow plugs two or three times so that could be it as well.

pajerry · Post by **pajerry** » Fri Mar 08, 2013 12:37 pm

Not sure if it was mentioned, but I was having starting issues, so I bought new plugs thinking it was probably them. Took it all apart, tested each old plug, they were all good. Cleaned it up, put it back together, and it has started as good as ever, half a crank, very little warmup. Just cleaning the grease and crap off, and making sure the busbar is clean will go a long way.

tonydca · Post by **tonydca** » Fri Mar 08, 2013 1:18 pm

pajerry wrote:Not sure if it was mentioned, but I was having starting issues, so I bought new plugs thinking it was probably them. Took it all apart, tested each old plug, they were all good. Cleaned it up, put it back together, and it has started as good as ever, half a crank, very little warmup. Just cleaning the grease and crap off, and making sure the busbar is clean will go a long way.

X2

CREGAN · Post by **CREGAN** » Fri Mar 08, 2013 8:42 pm

If you really want to clean the poop out of that bus bar you can soak it in some vinegar and salt for about 15-20 minutes then gently aggitate with an old toothbrush and rinse with cold water. Mine shines like a pretty penny. I think I am going to make this a yearly thing.

Craig

BackRoads · Post by **BackRoads** » Tue Apr 23, 2013 5:54 pm

I'm in a similar boat as Dino. Last November I bought a diesel 95 L400 with 74,000km that has started poorly since I got it. Neither myself or the dealer have been able to fix the cold start problem (smoke, misses, rough etc). I won't get into the story about why I bought a rough starting van...

Some of the things that could be possibly related to starting/performance that the dealer replaced before I bought it:
- new thermostat
- new water pump
- new alternator
- new fuel filter (also checked by me to make sure 1 way valve works)
- new air filter
- new injection pump front seal
- Clean & pre set the 4 injector
- install used glow plugs that passed dealer's inspection
- new glow plug bus bar

I live in Victoria away from the Vancouver dealer so at home I did the following work:
- installed 2 new batteries - no change
- installed a clear fuel line on the return side of the injector pump so I can check for air leaks - Noticed small air bubbles in the fuel.
- Bled fuel filter and primed before starting. ~3 pumps of air always came out before fuel did. Bled/prime improved cold starts, but still rough.
- Replaced all the low pressure rubber fuel lines with bulk fuel hose - no change.
- Checked fuses and specs on various electricial components e.g. TPS, bus bar voltage, sensors, glow plug relay etc. 2 pin water tempterature senor not in spec - replace. No change.
- Use dealer recommended fuel additives. No noticable change with or without.
- Seafoam treatment at IP and tank. No change in starting.
- Turbo Pressure Relief (aka blow off) valve released on long steep hill.
- Check turbo wastegate, might have been stuck. Lube, ensure proper function. No change in starting, but seems fixed for hills.
- Blanked off EGR. - No change in starting.

Take it back and forth between Victoria and Van 3 times to see dealer where the following work was done:

- Replaced plugs with new NGK plugs - Improved starting, but still lumpy, smokes.
- Replace glow plug relay - no change
- Increased the cold start advancement - No noticable change.
- Pay to have full rebuild on IP. More power, less smoke. Now starts with more misses, but they are smaller 'kicks' compared to before. E.g. At 5 degrees there would be 13 big kicks that ended after 90 seconds, now 20 small kicks that lasted 2 minutes. Now more air can be bled out of the fuel filter was ~3, now ~8).
- Adjust kickdown cable.

Starting last weekend, the glow plug heating light now stays on permanently. ECU seems fine. I'm now on this site looking for a possible cause for that and cold start (hopefully related). I've had the van for 6 months and in that time a host of problems have occured (e.g. not much heat (fixed) seized calipers (fixed), sun shade broke (to-do list), heated seats stopped functioning (fixed) and lots more). Not too pleased with this Delica so far, but I still love it for camping.

I'm pretty much out of ideas for the cold start issue. Even though the IP had a full rebuild I think it's part of the probem (small air bubbles still come out to the return line and I can bleed air out of the fuel filter).

I would appreciate any other ideas. I'm planning to take it to CVI in June which is the next time I can get over to Vancouver.

Thanks

Dino · Post by **Dino** » Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:00 pm

Well, for the most part it's warmer here now so I only get the odd day when the morning start is rough. I did replace the fuel filter (previous one was a Boshi, and I replaced with a Boshi), and the air filter. Still no change in starting when cool. As soon as it's 5* or higher it might give one or two misses with a tiny puff of smoke and then she's all happy. After the start she runs like a champ.

I've gotten used to living with it at the moment. Until next fall I don't think I'll be able to do any further troubleshooting, but I'm pretty well out of ideas. My next step would likely be an injector re-build but I'll have to locate a diesel shop willing to tackle that around here as it's certainly out of my comfort zone.

Sorry to hear you've been bitten by the same bucking bug BackRoads. I hate having to give excuses when people tell me my truck smokes too much when I start it

Mind you if you watch some of the old Cummins 5.9L engines fire up first thing in the morning, it makes ours look like a campfire next to an incinerator

Firesong · Post by **Firesong** » Wed Apr 24, 2013 6:25 am

Don't rebuild the injectors, I put a link up where to buy new ones for a great price.
(On the other topic link)

I'm picking up a new set for my new l400 once the l300 sells.

FS

CREGAN · Post by **CREGAN** » Wed Apr 24, 2013 7:31 am

Firesong wrote:Don't rebuild the injectors, I put a link up where to buy new ones for a great price.
(On the other topic link)

I'm picking up a new set for my new l400 once the l300 sells.

FS

X2

I found out the hard way that it is way cheaper to buy new injectors than rebuild.

Craig

BackRoads · Post by **BackRoads** » Wed Apr 24, 2013 5:06 pm

I hear you on the excuses Dino. I'm out of good reasons to give for the smoke and rough starts. Warmer temps mean it's no so bad now, but I still want to find the cause(s).

The two things I'm thinking of doing next are:
- replace injectors. They were cleaned and tested by dealer, but so were the glow plugs when they should have been replaced.
- clean filter in fuel tank. On heavy acceleration up hills it seems like there might be a fuel starvation issue. I want to make sure this screen isn't gummed up.

The lagging symptom also possibly feels like it's thinking about changing gears (TPS, kickdown cable, fluid, OD and AT/Power all appear to check out).

Either way, when I'm going for full power I sense a weak link in the chain. Maybe it's also related to the cold start issue??? Fingers crossed these next two bits of work improve something. After that then it's off to CVI where hopefully they can fix both issues.

Cheers

BackRoads · Post by **BackRoads** » Wed Apr 24, 2013 7:25 pm

Well the screen at the fuel pick up was clean as a whistle. No chunks or goo anywhere in the tank.

Onto the injectors....

Firesong · Post by **Firesong** » Wed Apr 24, 2013 7:55 pm

You mentioned your ip pump was done but you didn't do your injectors (other than a clean). Order some new ones.

BackRoads · Post by **BackRoads** » Thu Apr 25, 2013 2:25 pm

Thanks Firesong. I ordered some new ones from ebay UK. Went with the full injectors (ME200204) instead of just the nozzles (ME731687).

$330 CDN includes washers. Plus I expect to pay some duty.

BackRoads · Post by **BackRoads** » Fri May 10, 2013 10:01 am

Well the new injectors are in and so far so good. Totally smooth starts. No hiccups, misses or bucking. Whoo-hoo!!!

So after 7 months of trying to figure out this issue, the main lessons learned are:
1) Dealer said glow plugs were replaced with 'good' ones. They weren't new though. Dealer then replaced with new NGK and it helped a lot.
2) Dealer replaced front seal on IP. There was still a lot of air in system so I paid to have full rebuild. This resulted in more power and changed the cold starting issue from a few big bucks to more bucks but each one was a much smaller kick.
3) Dealer cleaned fuel injectors and then maybe replaced??? I visited the dealer multiple times to have the cold start issue fixed and if my memory serves me correctly, I asked if he replaced the fuel injectors with new ones. Not just cleaned, not 2nd hand, but new. His answer was yes. I thought the injectors were brand new which is why I didn't think they were part of the issue.

However, when looking at the injectors, it was obvious the tops weren't new (corrosion). Perhaps the dealer may have just replaced the nozzles.

But because the dealer originally put in used glow plugs that sucked, I thought that he may have done the same with the injectors. I live on Vancouver Island and didn't want to make a 5th trip over to Vancouver and come back with the issue not fixed....again. It was easier to deal with it myself.

So to totally fix the cold start issue I believe it took all three: new glow plugs, new fuel injectors and full IP rebuild.

Because I trusted the dealer's opinion that these were all fine, I originally dismissed them and I did a lot of other work trying to figure out this issue. However, along the way I learned a lot and did plenty of other maintenance (lube turdo wastegate, not just disconnect but actually blank off EGR, batteries, fuel lines, water temp sensor, calipers, etc etc).

Fingers crossed that when temps drop this fall that my Deli still starts smooth!

Firesong · Post by **Firesong** » Fri May 10, 2013 4:21 pm

Good to hear good news!

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