1994 L400 Cold Start trouble

[delicat]

Just figured it out, I've got a fried ECU, fried relay and ugly looking connection at the coolant/plug sensor. Ugly!

[lopar]

1994 L400 - yes there is a big relay top right of engine compartment mounted under the hood, can't miss it.

Observing with meter........ at plugs: similar to what others are saying
- immediate "click" (12V+), glow plugs on, for variable amount of time depending on temperature, I have experienced about 3-7 sec so far for cold start
- second "click" (0V+), glow plugs turn off
- after starting "click" (12V+), glow plugs back on
- after about 1-2 minutes final click (0V+), glow plugs off

First and second round of glow plugs both 12V+, nothing fancy..... one relay, one voltage, two cycles..... nice and simple like it should be

[Mr. Pistachio]

so does my L400
1. First click at key contact
2. Second click 30 sec ishh after
3. Third click at least 10 block!

Mine idle rough but with at 1500rpm for 30 sec runs awesome

[Rural]

I am experiencing the same issues: On cold mornings (anything below 0C) I might crank for as much as 30 seconds before the engine starts to kick. Another 10 seconds of cranking and it will keep itself going. 10 seconds of that and it will rev up. At that point I will either choose to let off the throttle and get about 800 RPM or keep it at about 1100 for 20 seconds or so. It will begin to smooth out at this point, quicker if I've kept the revs up. Up until this point, the van will be spitting out an an impressive amount of smoke. Very impressive. This will begin to subside. After five minutes, she's running smooth and the exhaust is clear.

After getting it running, it will start again with very little trouble...unless it sits for more than about 3 hours. (Less if it's cold. More if it's warm.)

Plugging in the block heater for 45 minutes to an hour before starting it in the morning seems to help. The engine will kick more quickly and run smoothly in less time.

Cold and moist seems to be worse than cold and dry.

Above 10C or so, and there is only a bit of smoky exhaust. Above 15C and all is well.

I've checked for voltage at the plugs, and it looks like they are getting current (12V, then 0V, then 12V). The plugs have been replaced. My mechanic is working up the confidence for the injection pump shaft seal. Any day now it's going in for that. I'm thinking I'll have him talk to Mardy (who sold it to me) before he does the work.

[KNOLL]

I usually turn the key till the glow light turns off, then repeat 2 times, starts fine after that.

[tonydca]

I've checked for voltage at the plugs, and it looks like they are getting current (12V, then 0V, then 12V). The plugs have been replaced. My mechanic is working up the confidence for the injection pump shaft seal. Any day now it's going in for that. I'm thinking I'll have him talk to Mardy (who sold it to me) before he does the work.

Before you drop the coin on an IP overhaul, double-check your plugs - what type are they?

(below is from a previous post of mine):

***********************************

New glow plugs - all is well.

My symptoms were:

- The engine would always "catch" and start firing on the first or second crank.
- If the vehicle was stored underground (+15 degC) or if it was outside at or above +15 degC, no problems. Didn't matter how long it sat cold. This is why I primarily thought glow plugs, since I understand that a leaky IP seal would let in some air overnight and you'd have a rough start no matter the temperature.
- The colder, the more worster-er it got. But the lumpy idle was always rhythmically-lumpy. Like the same cylinder(s) had issues. Again, points to one or more plugs on their way out.

So if you're trying to diagnose, see if you can store your beast in the warm for a day or so (or leave the block heater on) and see if she starts up right away. If so, I'd suspect plugs over IP.

But if you have changed your plugs to no avail, I am beginning to suspect that not all glow plugs are created equal.

I had months ago tried a set of HKT plugs part # CP-05, and they were absolute garbage (for me). I went back to a set of used plugs of unknown origin (off an imported van - I could find no replacements at the time), and they served me fine until recently.

Butch at CVI gave me a set of Hyundai OEM plugs for their 4M40 vehicle (Hyundai Mobus part # Y722JS), and the tip was slightly (1mm?) longer than my dying ones. Butch assured me they fit, and tho' I held my breath when I first turned it over with the new plugs, no problems.

I can't help but wonder that industry-wide, if glow plugs use a common thread size, then making a plug that 's a bit on the short side will allow them to be used in a wider range of vehicles, but not optimized perhaps for ours.

At any rate, I can vouch for these plugs:, and I'm a happy boy.

Tony.

[Rural]

Thanks for the tip Tony. The more I've thought about it when sitting in the van getting it to run smoothly, the more I've been coming to a similar conclusion. It really does seem like a cylinder or more is missing.

I wonder if Mardy would consider sending me a set of glow-plugs a warranty issue? Guess I'll find out shortly.

[...]

Before you drop the coin on an IP overhaul, double-check your plugs - what type are they?

(below is from a previous post of mine):

***********************************

New glow plugs - all is well.

My symptoms were:

- The engine would always "catch" and start firing on the first or second crank.
- If the vehicle was stored underground (+15 degC) or if it was outside at or above +15 degC, no problems. Didn't matter how long it sat cold. This is why I primarily thought glow plugs, since I understand that a leaky IP seal would let in some air overnight and you'd have a rough start no matter the temperature.
- The colder, the more worster-er it got. But the lumpy idle was always rhythmically-lumpy. Like the same cylinder(s) had issues. Again, points to one or more plugs on their way out.

[...]

[Rising Sun Auto Import]

I've checked for voltage at the plugs, and it looks like they are getting current (12V, then 0V, then 12V). The plugs have been replaced. My mechanic is working up the confidence for the injection pump shaft seal. Any day now it's going in for that. I'm thinking I'll have him talk to Mardy (who sold it to me) before he does the work.

Before you drop the coin on an IP overhaul, double-check your plugs - what type are they?

(below is from a previous post of mine):

***********************************

New glow plugs - all is well.

My symptoms were:

- The engine would always "catch" and start firing on the first or second crank.
- If the vehicle was stored underground (+15 degC) or if it was outside at or above +15 degC, no problems. Didn't matter how long it sat cold. This is why I primarily thought glow plugs, since I understand that a leaky IP seal would let in some air overnight and you'd have a rough start no matter the temperature.
- The colder, the more worster-er it got. But the lumpy idle was always rhythmically-lumpy. Like the same cylinder(s) had issues. Again, points to one or more plugs on their way out.

So if you're trying to diagnose, see if you can store your beast in the warm for a day or so (or leave the block heater on) and see if she starts up right away. If so, I'd suspect plugs over IP.

But if you have changed your plugs to no avail, I am beginning to suspect that not all glow plugs are created equal.

I had months ago tried a set of HKT plugs part # CP-05, and they were absolute garbage (for me). I went back to a set of used plugs of unknown origin (off an imported van - I could find no replacements at the time), and they served me fine until recently.

Butch at CVI gave me a set of Hyundai OEM plugs for their 4M40 vehicle (Hyundai Mobus part # Y722JS), and the tip was slightly (1mm?) longer than my dying ones. Butch assured me they fit, and tho' I held my breath when I first turned it over with the new plugs, no problems.
I can't help but wonder that industry-wide, if glow plugs use a common thread size, then making a plug that 's a bit on the short side will allow them to be used in a wider range of vehicles, but not optimized perhaps for ours.

At any rate, I can vouch for these plugs:, and I'm a happy boy.

Tony.

Try new glow plugs before putting money on IP work.
Most of hard start in the morning will be solved by replacing good quality glow plugs.
We are selling Hyundai glow plugs ( set of 4 ) at $120.

Steven

[MardyDelica]

Hi, rural,
just wait for few when i came back.
if it need the injection shaft seal change its better to change.
pls dont listen to people saying no need to change this shaft seal.
as thru my experience mostly they need to change the shaft seal thru ages.
this problem cannot just fix the glow plug. you will change the seal in the near future anyway so try to do the
proper job not the cheap way if possible.
even its expensive fix still you have peace of mind.
this is just my opinion .
just wait when i came back some of them are not glow plug issue.
will keep in touch
cheers;
Mardy

[Rural]

Ha! I just saw Mardy's post above. This is somewhat of a relief.

So the temperatures have been dropping and the van has been getting harder to start. The problem is almost definitely the glow plugs. I had talked to Mardy and he agreed to get me a new set. But I waited and no glow plugs appeared. Every so often, I'd fire him an email wondering what is going on.

Then yesterday, the temperature dropped to -12C and I was unsuccessful getting the van started, even after two hours of the block heater running. So I fired an email to Mardy expressing my disappointment. Tried the van again after another hour with the block heater on and it caught.

This morning, it was even colder, -15C. I had no luck starting the van. So I gave up on Mardy and began trying to track down the fellow who had the right glow plugs at $120 for the set (Steven from Assiniboine). Low and behold, I ran into this post from Mardy.

I guess he's on vacation or something. So he's somewhat off the hook. In the meantime, I'm vanless.

Looking forward to Mardy's return.

Hi, rural,
just wait for few when i came back.
if it need the injection shaft seal change its better to change.
pls dont listen to people saying no need to change this shaft seal.
as thru my experience mostly they need to change the shaft seal thru ages.
this problem cannot just fix the glow plug. you will change the seal in the near future anyway so try to do the
proper job not the cheap way if possible.
even its expensive fix still you have peace of mind.
this is just my opinion .
just wait when i came back some of them are not glow plug issue.
will keep in touch
cheers;
Mardy

[tonydca]

Hi rural. You can test your plugs yourself if you want. All I used was a single one of a pair of jumper cables:

- Clamp one end of a jumper cable to the (-) Neg terminal on your battery,
- Remove a plug from the head and grab the outer body of the plug with the other end of the same cable, so now the body of the plug is electrically connected to the (-) side of the battery.
- Using the cable as a convenient handle with which to hold your plug, reach in and carefully touch the end of the plug (where the nuts thread onto the busbar) to the (+) Pos side of the battery. Be careful not to touch the body of the plug to the (+) side or you'll get a *really* big spark!
- You might see a small spark when you first touch it - normal - but more importantly after about 4-5 seconds, the tip should be glowing orange-hot.

I found 1 duff plug out of 4, which encouraged me to drop the $130 and replace the set.

Edit: PS - Before you try to remove them, it doesn't hurt to spray the base of the plugs where they enter the head with a shot of WD40 and let it soak for 15 min before you start. I was paranoid about having one snap off, and so far so good.

[MardyDelica]

Hi, rural,
i am sorry about that i am just out of glow plug now maybe next week i have some coming from the phils.
so just wait for few days nothing much i can do. you should used a block heater plug now if you have, it will works for you now with the heater block.
this kind of issue of hard starting is not much we can do & cannot anticipate the thing happen when the cold weather drops to your area.
we all have same problem not only you,other of my customer has same issue.
frustration is there but just be patient. our hands is all full
hope this Help Cheers;
Mardy