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Re: Delica Dealer / Importer Ratings and Feedback
Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 6:10 pm
by Brave Auto International
flyfishn wrote:Ok, so Brave has some clients willing to respond. That is great. The thing here that annoys me is this is a public forum. People are entitled to ask a question. Sometimes if something is not worded correctly it offends people. These guys both had legitimate questions and concerns. Both (maybe all 3 ) dealers reacted strongly IMHO. You might feel justified in your responses to these 2 gentleman, but don't forget others will be reading these remarks and thinking that 1 of their own is getting bashed.
To the dealers, if something is posted and you feel offended, answer it as civil as you can. It goes a long way.
I cannot speak for Kieking as he has his own battles but.....if my reply was
not "civil" then I have no idea what is.
Thank you.
MB..
Re: Delica Dealer / Importer Ratings and Feedback
Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 6:30 pm
by flyfishn
Brave Auto International wrote: next time I will wait a few hours for the under bodies I wash to dry off completely before taking photos as I have nothing else better to do. Cheers
MB..
Re: Delica Dealer / Importer Ratings and Feedback
Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 6:55 pm
by Brave Auto International
flyfishn wrote:Brave Auto International wrote: next time I will wait a few hours for the under bodies I wash to dry off completely before taking photos as I have nothing else better to do. Cheers
MB..
quote="flyfishn"]
Brave Auto International wrote: next time I will wait a few hours for the under bodies I wash to dry off completely before taking photos as I have nothing else better to do. Cheers
MB..
Are you for real....... you class that as not being civil...... especially after he accused me of a cover up to start with.
Am I missing something........... oh yes.... all dealers, importers, workshops etc are meant to treat people with the upmost respect no matter what in your eyes. I am afraid I am old fashion and I will treat people as they treat me although saying that, my reply was more "civil" than his treatment of me to start with.
Cheers
MB..
Re: Delica Dealer / Importer Ratings and Feedback
Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 7:24 pm
by Delicafan
Brave, your going to make yourself look like a fool and seem very unproffesional if your here on the forums to argue with anyone. There is always going to be good, bad and ugly said about a company online ( even if there is no truth to any of the accusations ). Just put your head down, do the best you can, and be honest. People will recognize the hard work and take accusations like this with a grain of salt.
Re: Delica Dealer / Importer Ratings and FeedbackS
Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 7:41 pm
by Modsqwad
10 pages and growing! Maybe a moderator should put this thing to bed now. Its a touchy subject but the dealers need to be more
objective and just tell it like it is without acting like drama queens. If your pride can't handle a public forum don't read it. Sorry but
thats how I see it.
Andy Wilson
Re: Delica Dealer / Importer Ratings and Feedback
Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 7:53 pm
by Brave Auto International
Delicafan wrote:Brave, your going to make yourself look like a fool and seem very unproffesional if your here on the forums to argue with anyone. There is always going to be good, bad and ugly said about a company online ( even if there is no truth to any of the accusations ). Just put your head down, do the best you can, and be honest. People will recognize the hard work and take accusations like this with a grain of salt.
Words well said and you are correct………. except, I am not arguing with
everyone on here. Normally..... I am pretty charm and laid back but this one did get under my skin, probably more the fact I helped him in the beginning.
I can see there is no right or wrong here and we will move on…. tomorrow is another day.
Cheers
MB..
Re: Delica Dealer / Importer Ratings and Feedback
Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 11:49 pm
by maDDtraPPer
I am truly sorry I created such a fuss. I am a long ways from Vancouver, and a long ways from Japan. I work very hard for my money and I want to make a wise and careful purchase. I wouldn't have asked for help if I didnt think the Brave vehicle was worth my time and effort. I am sorry if I didn't word things exactly politically correct. I just wanted truth and facts and some support before proceeding to spend $7000 on a BLIND purchase with a company which was on the other side of the Pacific ocean and forgive me if purchasers don't accept pictures as proof enough of the condition of the vehicle.
Fact of the matter is here in Nunavut where I am on contract the internet is shit and I spent the better part of half a day looking at those pictures on the Brave website. I certainly didn't waste my valuable time which I am paid well for if I wasn't serious about buying a vehicle and that vehicle in particular. Fact of the matter I am within my rights to question why the vehicle is photographed when still wet, and why there is obvious signs of recent painting. I meant not to accuse the dealer but simply to find out the reasons and reputation behind them. Again I close with an appology and my respects. The bottom line is all I really want is a good quality L400 that I can load my dirt bikes in and drive to Mexico in the winter. Brave I am sorry if I wasn't as tactful as I could have been, and I also am sorry to has caused such a fuss. I simple wanted some support before sending a bunch of money overseas for a basically unsupported purchase.
Re: Delica Dealer / Importer Ratings and Feedback
Posted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 12:45 am
by delicat
Hey, sometimes we write something that we wish we could take back. Saying you know a cover up job when you see one could be one of those time, maybe. The real ugly is when you don't admit you might have went overboard and keep digging your hole deeper.
But, when you recognize what you wrote might have been a bit overdone and publicly apologize that shows a lot in my book. If we all remember our first importation (for those who bought over the internet), it's really scary. I really understand how little details could appear like monsters. I think Mark at Brave also understand that. I also hope he'd accept your apologies and welcome you back as a potential client for the simple reason that they have a very reputable company and some of the best cars. Just search other forums for different import vehicles and you'll get the point.
Welcome and good luck with finding a good truck.
David
Re: Delica Dealer / Importer Ratings and Feedback
Posted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 2:04 am
by Brave Auto International
maDDtraPPer wrote: Brave I am sorry if I wasn't as tactful as I could have been, and I also am sorry to has caused such a fuss.
Thank you for admitting that you could of been a bit more tactful as you put it. I also apologize....maybe I could of handled it a little better although I still feel I was civil in my reply to you.
Any way....lets move on..... if you have questions about L300/400's (how many bikes can fit for example) please feel free to ask me. Although we did not get off to a wonderful start the information is still free.
Cheers
MB..
Re: Delica Dealer / Importer Ratings and Feedback
Posted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 3:49 am
by delicat
Re: Delica Dealer / Importer Ratings and Feedback
Posted: Sun Jul 26, 2009 12:31 pm
by bryanc
maDDtraPPer wrote:I am truly sorry I created such a fuss. I am a long ways from Vancouver, and a long ways from Japan. I work very hard for my money and I want to make a wise and careful purchase. I wouldn't have asked for help if I didnt think the Brave vehicle was worth my time and effort. I am sorry if I didn't word things exactly politically correct. I just wanted truth and facts and some support before proceeding to spend $7000 on a BLIND purchase with a company which was on the other side of the Pacific ocean and forgive me if purchasers don't accept pictures as proof enough of the condition of the vehicle.
Fact of the matter is here in Nunavut where I am on contract the internet is shit and I spent the better part of half a day looking at those pictures on the Brave website. I certainly didn't waste my valuable time which I am paid well for if I wasn't serious about buying a vehicle and that vehicle in particular. Fact of the matter I am within my rights to question why the vehicle is photographed when still wet, and why there is obvious signs of recent painting. I meant not to accuse the dealer but simply to find out the reasons and reputation behind them. Again I close with an appology and my respects. The bottom line is all I really want is a good quality L400 that I can load my dirt bikes in and drive to Mexico in the winter. Brave I am sorry if I wasn't as tactful as I could have been, and I also am sorry to has caused such a fuss. I simple wanted some support before sending a bunch of money overseas for a basically unsupported purchase.
I bought a DELICA from Mark i can honestly say he is ANAL about describing the condition of his vehicles , even after my Delica arrived i had trouble finding the imperfections he pointed out in his photo's and after almost 40,000 km the worst thing that has gone wrong is the turbo timer quit on me .
just my 2 cents , Bryan
Re: Delica Dealer / Importer Ratings and Feedback
Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2009 10:49 pm
by jdmvip
This is an interesting thread so I thought I would make some general thoughts about it. I am not in the auto business or anything related to JDM cars, although I did start a site to help owners learn more about the vehicles, process of importing and reputation of the different companies.
So I've literally seen and heard hundreds of complaints and praises for all kinds of Importers and Exporters. I hate to "class" things but there are a few kinds of people who make reports but here I go :) (no offense or pun intended)
Some people know lots about the vehicle they are buying and some know nothing. Equally so are some who have no idea how to pick a good Importer or Exporter and who don't understand how things work in Japan (that not every vehicle is low mileage and in perfect condition and also don't forget rollbacks and odometer swapped vehicles etc...)
What I'm saying is that some complaints are based on a lack of knowledge or understanding about how things work and assumptions that a company is doing something wrong when they aren't.
At the same time, I think there are some very legitimate complaints (not necessarily in this thread) in general about a lot of Exporters, and some are very well deserved and can't be classed as "accidental". Accidents happen and it's how a company makes up for it or responds to it that counts, assuming that "accidents" aren't common place with whatever company we're talking about.
It's also understandable (in the case where a company has done nothing wrong), that you're going to get a strong reaction. It's important to remember that this is someone's business and reputation, and making baseless comments about their company isn't going to get a good response (although it is in the best interest of the company to be professional even when wrongly accused). Of course in the cases of some very solid and detailed complaints I've seen with some very crooked Exporters, you'll also find that reaction, along with all kinds of threats.
You also have to take complaints with a grain of salt and here's where I find some of the people who complain a cause of frustration. They often provide few details or facts other than saying "xyz company is no good". I'm willing to bet half of the complaints by those kinds of posters are half-truths or based on a lack of knowledge or misunderstandings.
This also applies to positive comments, sometimes it's based on a small group of friends or even people affiliated with the company. I've seen other forums where some companies appear to have a good rep, because they sponsor the site and have all negative comments deleted (it's really a shame that some forums go this route and sacrifice their members for $)
In the end the customer who is looking for a JDM has things to worry about, but also has a duty to research the car and reptuation of the company they're dealing with. At the same time, if you do your research you'll have no trouble finding an excellent company with an excellent track record. Then there's the other side of the fence, some companies with good reps and offering a good service are frustrated when they're attacked without any merit. And of course the side of the fence I can't defend, the many well known crooked Importers and Exporters who spend more time making threats and having posts removed from various sites that document how shady they are.
That's my 2 cents.
Re: Delica Dealer / Importer Ratings and Feedback
Posted: Tue Jul 28, 2009 10:14 am
by Erebus
GISdood wrote:Why WOULDN'T the dealers get their hackles up and respond in kind? They have the most to lose from implications of cover ups and poor sales practices. The general public here is most likely sitting in stunned silence and shaking their collective heads at your statements. The dealers aren't running things, they're defending their reputations and their businesses.
As someone sitting on the sidelines ... I'm not sitting in stunned silence, I'm watching -- kinda like a tennis match -- the ball go back and forth, and deciding who is being legit, who has a chip on their shoulder, who is trying to hide something, and who is an idiot.
When a dealer gets his hackles up, and attacks someone, I tend to assume he has something to hide. If Brave had simply responded with "Sorry, I took the photos after washing the vehicle and it was still wet" that would have been fine. But the snarky and sarcastic answer did nothing to improve his image.
Another "signals analysis" I do is look at who is posting the questions, and who is posting defences. If the person defending a dealer has only posted a couple of times, and the one questioning the dealer has been on the forum for months and posted many times, my BS meter tends to twitch.
Dealers: in your mind you may be responding to only one person, but there may be a hundred people reading the thread, so you better be careful how you respond. Polite, reasoned responses (which may be hard at times) will go a long way to convincing others reading the thread that you are being falsely accused or misunderstood. Doing things like posting in giant typefaces or comments like, "If you don't at least have a friend that's a mechanic you must live in a rabbit hole" are certain to get MY hackles up.
In closing, I'm happy with my Delica, so I'm not shopping. But I do get asked by people, so my opinion should matter to dealers. And when the time comes to replace this Delica, all these posts by dealers, and comments from buyers, will be considered.
Re: Delica Dealer / Importer Ratings and Feedback
Posted: Tue Jul 28, 2009 8:06 pm
by bigbird
Erebus....A-freaking-men!
Re: Delica Dealer / Importer Ratings and Feedback
Posted: Wed Jul 29, 2009 12:33 am
by almac
I'm just a "kick the tires before i buy" kinda guy.
I just NEED to open the doors, sit in the back, play with the options
, and finally test drive a vehicle before i decide to buy. to me a vehicle is an important purchase, and for me, can't be bought like a tent from a catalog or online shopping...
i personally refuse to put a deposit down on something i haven't seen up close and driven.
and i mean NO insulting or disparaging remarks to any of the dealers... this is just the way i am.
if i have to wait longer to find my bus, then so be it. i live in the okanagan so this makes my search more difficult, but i will live with it.
i have been passively hunting for a month now, and am in no hurry to buy(I'm fussy...
).
I saw more Delis on the island than i have ever seen in my life! (most were being driven or in parking lots...) I checked a few lots, but thought the delis were overpriced... im pretty sure i could get a better deal elsewhere...
I will know my baby when i actually walk up to it, drive it, and caress it...
