Suddenly won't start

Does your Mitsubishi L300 make a strange noise? Need wheel alignment specs?
Morgonzo
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Suddenly won't start

Postby Morgonzo » Tue Nov 15, 2016 12:22 pm

+1 on getting some clear lines into a container of fresh Diesel (or Seafoam..) and bypassing the rest of the fuel system to see if it'll start. The question on my mind is..would a clogged fuel pick-up in the tank burn out the solenoid?
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Growlerbearnz
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Suddenly won't start

Postby Growlerbearnz » Tue Nov 15, 2016 11:34 pm

Replacement rubber fuel line is usually sold by the foot at NAPA or similar. You might have to get creative to find the transparent hose- maybe a hardware store? Transparent hose is not very fuel or heat resistant, so it would only be installed temporarily for diagnostic purposes. Don't be tempted to drive anywhere with transparent hose installed!

The seal kit is easy- find a Bosch VE rebuild kit. Part number DC-VE008 is fairly generic, and is sold as suitable for all sorts of vehicles.

Installing the seals isn't as easy. I guess every step is easy, but there are a lot of steps. Check out the pictorial rebuild guide here: http://gnarlodious.com/Vanagon/Bosch_Pump/-Rebuild
Nothing says "poor workmanship" more than wrinkles in the duct tape.

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Suddenly won't start

Postby pluckmyeyeout » Fri Nov 18, 2016 4:11 pm

OK - Couldn't stay away. Picked up some clear hoses. Was thinking I might just try to hook up the hose directly to the injector pump to see about bypassing the fuel filter. But then I realized that I don't really know how to get fuel into the hose itself... Just syphon as best I can, then bleed the injectors until the line is full of fuel?

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Growlerbearnz
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Suddenly won't start

Postby Growlerbearnz » Fri Nov 18, 2016 4:33 pm

If you unplug the cutoff solenoid and crank the engine, that should draw fuel through the pump body without getting air into the injectors (though I've not actually tried it).
Nothing says "poor workmanship" more than wrinkles in the duct tape.

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pluckmyeyeout
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Suddenly won't start

Postby pluckmyeyeout » Mon Nov 28, 2016 1:06 pm

Had to put this one on the shelf for a moment, but back to it. So there are two fuel lines coming off of the fuel tank. One goes to the fuel filter, the other directly to the back of the injector pump. So. Got some hoses. But now I'm confused about which one-or-more hoses to run to the external can fuel?

Do I just take the fuel-filter side of line "V" off and drop it in a bucket-o-fuel?

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pluckmyeyeout
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Suddenly won't start

Postby pluckmyeyeout » Mon Nov 28, 2016 1:07 pm

Helps if I attached the picture.
Attachments
Screenshot 2016-11-28 15.05.25.png
Screenshot 2016-11-28 15.05.25.png (162.44 KiB) Viewed 1504 times

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Growlerbearnz
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Suddenly won't start

Postby Growlerbearnz » Mon Nov 28, 2016 4:51 pm

You've got it. Drop V into bucket of fuel, watch W for bubbles.

It took me a moment to figure it out though: This diagram is the fuel tank side of the fuel lines. V is fuel supply to the injection pump, W is fuel return from the pump to the tank.
Nothing says "poor workmanship" more than wrinkles in the duct tape.

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pluckmyeyeout
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Suddenly won't start

Postby pluckmyeyeout » Mon Nov 28, 2016 7:48 pm

Just curious - why is there a return line to the tank? What purpose does that serve? (NEWB)

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Suddenly won't start

Postby Growlerbearnz » Mon Nov 28, 2016 8:59 pm

bosch-ve-injection-pump-diagram-l-b7f157aa4af9cd5e.jpg
bosch-ve-injection-pump-diagram-l-b7f157aa4af9cd5e.jpg (314.84 KiB) Viewed 1491 times


The fuel supply pump (G) sucks fuel out of the tank, filling and pressurising* the interior of the injection pump. The Overflow Valve (U) sets the internal pressure and allows excess fuel to return to the tank. Without an overflow valve internal pressure would just keep building until the seals burst.

The injectors themselves also create a bit of excess fuel too- the (unlabelled) plunger (O) pushes a shot of highly pressurised fuel to the injector, which forces the injector open. As the plunger nears the end of its stroke the fuel pressure is no longer enough to keep the injector open and it snaps shut, diverting the last little bit of fuel to the return rail (the small wiggly pipe that's strung between all 4 injectors).

*Down the rabbit hole we go: To get the most push out of your fuel, you want it to ignite just as the piston starts to go back down the bore. Thanks to the laws of physics and chemistry there's a fixed delay of a few milliseconds between injecting the fuel and ignition, so as the engine goes faster you need to inject the fuel earlier to synchronise the moment of ignition with the piston. This is achieved by having the pressure in the injector pump drive the timing device (J). As engine speed increases, pressure increases, and the timing device moves the start of injection earlier so that the fuel continues to burn at the right time.
On later model engines they replaced the overflow valve (U) with a computer-controlled valve so they could regulate the pressure in the pump and injection timing independently of engine speed, allowing higher boost levels and more power output without the risk of blowing up the engine on a hot day.
Nothing says "poor workmanship" more than wrinkles in the duct tape.

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pluckmyeyeout
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Suddenly won't start

Postby pluckmyeyeout » Tue Nov 29, 2016 11:45 am

That makes sense! I mean, I get the gist of it. Too much pressure means you have to relieve it in some way... Another few days of rain and no garage means I guess I'll try this weekend...

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Suddenly won't start

Postby Zebruken » Tue May 02, 2017 11:29 pm

pluckmyeyeout wrote:That makes sense! I mean, I get the gist of it. Too much pressure means you have to relieve it in some way... Another few days of rain and no garage means I guess I'll try this weekend...


So what every happened @pluckmyeyeout? Did you resolve the issue, if so what was it? My van just went from running like a champ, to starting, running rough and dying...makes me think fuel starved.

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Suddenly won't start

Postby Zebruken » Wed May 03, 2017 8:24 pm

I ended up on this thread last night (05/02/17) because my Delica wouldn't start all of the sudden.

I haven't even had the van for a week I was thinking that maybe the fuel gauge was off and I ran it dry. So I walked the mile home, got in my Volvo 245 and drove to Walmart to buy a 5 gallon diesel can. I filled up the can and went back to the Delica, put the diesel in...but it still wouldn't start.

Luckly Sabbir from Maxoverdrive.ca (located in Richmond BC) is who I bought the van from and he replied to my emails late that night (This all was taking place after midnight, in the rain). Sabbir pointed me in a few directions to seek out the issue. To me it seemed like it was a fuel delivery issue. But it was late and I needed to sleep.

The next morning I got up early and drove down to where the van was, and began poking and prodding. I noticed that the fuel line from the tank to the filter had a split on the filter end and you could see the bump on the nipple that is supposed to help keep the fuel line connected. So I walked to an auto shop, purchased a new fuel line, hooked it up, primed the system and started right up.

I'm sure you've already gotten yours fixed by now, but I thought I'd share what got mine going again in case anyone else is looking here to figure out why their Delica isn't starting all of the sudden.

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pluckmyeyeout
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Suddenly won't start

Postby pluckmyeyeout » Wed May 24, 2017 11:43 am

Welp.

After my last post, going on six+ months ago now, I just didn't have the heart to come back here. I was at my wits end with attempting to look at the fuel lines. Every time I disconnected one, fuel would leak and get everywhere. I ended up soaked. The driveway ended up soaked. I just wasn't equipped to deal with it. So I realized I was at my wits end, and then... let it sit for six months? !!! Because... I don't know why really. I was sad to look at it sitting, and I was sad to come back here to report back....

Part of it was finding someone that I trusted to work on it. I have a VW TDI guy who was psyched to work on it: 4 cyl turbo diesel expert, who at least knew what it was. But he's had a VW TDI of mine for literally over a year (doing major work... but not THAT major). I was more or less waiting for him to finish the VW and then I was going to bring the Deli to him. I'd swing by every few weeks and tell him as soon as he's done with the VW I'd bring him the Deli, but the VW's still not done. So I sought out another diesel specialist, and I found one who was interested in taking a look.

So that brings us to now.

The shop spent a few hours with it, going through everything... Just little stuff, and then got it to fire up! Reportedly without any major issues. The report was that after charging the batteries, it now fired up and idles fine. But now it won't come up off of idle. Just dies. The diagnosis is that the fuel pump isn't working and their solution when a fuel pump isn't working is to replace it. I'm not super confident in that assessment, or at least solution. The pump has been rebuilt at least once before, as indicated by the paint previously discussed on this thread.

Any thoughts on the new problem? Worth getting a second opinion? Not terribly concerned about rebuilding or replacing the pump, should it come to that: I'm all for doing something that improves the overall mechanical condition of a vehicle I plan on driving 4-eva-eva. But, also, not too enamored with a mechanic that says: I dunno, replace the whole big thing!

What say you oh Delica.ca siblings?

Recap: Fuel cut solenoid goes bad. Replace it. Some kind of fuel delivery problem.... Now won't come up off of idle.

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Growlerbearnz
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Suddenly won't start

Postby Growlerbearnz » Wed May 24, 2017 3:42 pm

After all the frustration you've had I'm impressed that it only took 6 months to relax. I would have burnt the damned thing to the ground by now, or at least thrown a hammer at it.

At this stage I think you've exhausted all the simple solutions- it almost has to be something internal to the pump that's failed. A rebuilt pump would be my next step, especially if it comes from a reputable company and has a warranty.
Nothing says "poor workmanship" more than wrinkles in the duct tape.

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pluckmyeyeout
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Suddenly won't start

Postby pluckmyeyeout » Fri May 26, 2017 8:17 am

Now - where to source one?


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